Glad I’m not the only one… The hell is it doing after epic?

Yes. But only if you don’t pronounce GIF like a heathen.

so do some folks use opp as “opponent”? Sure, that’s believable. But I feel fairly confident…

Bro, it doesn’t even have the right number of P’s for your reasoning to make any sense.

It comes from “opponent,” that’s why there are two P’s. It comes from video games/chess/card games/etc where you refer to the person or persons you’re playing against as the “opponent”. It’s been happening for many years but has made it’s way into gen z slang.

That’s because it is. People who don’t understand just make shit up. That’s why the number of P’s doesn’t even line up.

Yeah, I just meant for explaining the function of what the thing does.

It’s basically an analog version of an HDMI cable. Except no audio, only video.

It’s like the yellow RCA cable, but for computer monitors instead of TVs

Aren’t a lot of US’s enemies closer if you go around the West instead of to the east? I think your maps backwards.

You seem to think I’m just talking about linearly expanding the vocabulary of the model, I’m talking about giving it an entirely new paradigm through which to work.

No, I don’t. I know exactly what you’re trying to say. But you’re basically talking about trying to make a car fly. That’s not how it was built and it’s goals and foundations are entirely different. You’re better off starting over and building a plane. Your proposal just doesn’t fit within the paradigms of what was built and makes no sense.

I’m talking building in entirely new ways for the AI to understand.

Exactly. But the AI doesn’t “understand” anything. In order to achieve this, you need to build something that “understands” things. LLMs don’t understand anything.

Anyway, this is why no one likes pedants. If you want to actually engage in conversation, sure.

It’s easy to label me as a pendant, but I’m explaining how this stuff works. You clearly have no idea, admitted yourself that you don’t understand, and then keep going. You just keep spewing the same shit, but the shit you’re spewing makes no sense. But you refuse to budge or engage in conversation here.

You’re just talking out of your ass. You’re admittedly uneducated but want to be treated like you’re educated and make any sense. You don’t. This is why people hate people pretending to be experts and talking about things they don’t understand. It’s a waste of time.

If you want to keep living in some imaginary world where this can be done, be my guest, but it’s fake. That’s not how this shit works. Enjoy your imaginary quest though.

I didn’t say any researcher or anything had named it intelligence. Nor am I trying to be semantically correct.

Read the guys comments. He’s trying to push the idea that we can “change” it’s “understanding” about the things it’s discussing. He is one of the people who has fallen for the tech bros etc convincing people it is intelligent. I’m not fighting semantics, I’m trying to explain to him that it’s not intelligent. Because he himself clearly doesn’t understand that.

I don’t see any reason these kinds of relationships can’t be integrated into generative AI, they just HAVEN’T yet

No, it’s just fucking pointless. You’re talking about adding sand to a beach. These things are way more complicated and trying to shovel these things in just makes a mess. See literally the OP.

each time you increase how the relationships interact, you’re also drastically increasing the size and complexity of the algorithm and model.

No youre not. Not even fucking close. You clearly don’t understand this at all.

The ALGORITHM will always be the same. Except for new generations of these bots. Claiming adding things like racial bias is going to alter the algorithm is just nonsensical.

The MODEL is the huge fucking corpus of internet data. Anything you tack onto it is a drop in an ocean. It’s not steering anything.

Whats changing is they’re editing inputs because that’s all you can really do to shift where these things go. Other changes would turn this into a very different beast, and can’t be done at the fine grained level like “race”.

Claiming this has any significant impact on the size or complexity of any of this is just total hog wash and you must not understand how these work or how big they are.

You’re just rephrasing the same approach, over, and over, and over. It’s like you’re not even reading what I’m saying.

The answer is no. This is not a feasible approach. LLMs are just parrots and they don’t understand anything. They were essentially a “shortcut” that gets something that acts intelligent without actually having to build something intelligent. You’re not going to convince it to be intelligent. You’re not going to solve all it’s short comings by shoe horning something in. It’s just more work than building actual intelligence.

It’s like if a costal town got overrun by flooding from a hurricane. And some guy shows up and is like “hey, I’ve got a bucket, I’ll just pull all the water to the sea”. And I’m like “that’s infeasible, we need a different solution, your bucket even has fucking holes in it”. And you’re over here saying “well, what if we got some duct tape? And then we can patch the holes. And then we can call our friends, and we can all bucket the water”.

It’s just not happening.

Eh I really need to learn more about AI to understand the limits

Yeah. This. You just keep repeating the same approach over and over without understanding or listening to the basic failings of these chat bots. It’s just not happening. You’re just perpetuating nonsense.

These things are basically slightly more complicated versions of the auto complete in your phone keyboard. Except that they’re fed hug amounts of the internet. They get really good at parroting sentences, but they have no sense of “intelligence” or what they’re actually doing. You’re better off trying to convince your auto correct to sound like Shakespeare than you are to remove the failings like racial bias from things like Gemini and ChatGPT. You can chip at small corners here and there but this is just not the path forward.

I don’t know, maybe that would work, for this one particular problem. My point is it’s more than that. Even if you go through the trouble of fixing this one particular issue with LLMs, there are literally thousands of other problems to solve before it’s all “fixed”. At some point, when you’ve built and maintained thousands of workarounds, they start conflicting with each other and making a giant spider web of issues to juggle.

And so you’re right back at the problem that you were trying to solve by building the LLM in the first place. This approach is just futile and nonsensical.

Someone posted the version I saw below. In that one, the person has only typed “Fe”. I haven’t seen one that had “Febu” typed, but yeah, that obviously would throw it.

They didn’t? At least in the version I’ve seen, they typed “Fe” and excel auto filled the “buary”. That’s the whole point of the meme.

Apparently without any correction there is significant racist bias.

This doesn’t make it any less ridiculous. This is a central pillar of this kind of AI tech, and they’re trying to shove a band aid over the most obvious example of it. Clearly, that doesn’t work. It’s also only even attempting to fix one of the “problems” - they’re never going to be able to “band aid” every single place where the AI exhibits this problem, so it’s going to leave thousands of others un-fixed. Even if their band aid works, it only continues to mask the shortcomings of this tech and makes it less obvious to people that it’s horrendously inacurrate with the other things it does.

Basically the AI reflects the long term racial bias in the training data. According to this BBC article it was an attempt to correct this bias but went a bit overboard.

Exactly. This is a core failing of LLM tech. It’s just going to repeat all the shit it was fed to it. You’re never going to fix that. You can attempt to steer it in different directions, but the reason this tech was used was because it is otherwise impossible for us to trudge through all the info that was fed to it. This was the only way to get it to “understand” everything. But all of it’s understandings are going to have these biases, and it’s going to be just as impossible to run through and fix all of these. It’s like you didn’t have enough metal to build the titanic so you just built it out of Swiss cheese and are trying to duct tape one hole closed so it doesn’t sink. It’s just never going to work.

This being pushed as some artificial INTELLIGENCE is the problem here. This shit doesn’t understand what it’s doing, it’s just regurgitating the things it’s consumed. It’s going to be exactly as flawed as whatever was put into it, and you can’t change that. The internet media it was trained on is racist, biased, full of undeniably false information, and massively swayed by propaganda on all sides of the fence. You can’t expect LLMs to do anything different when trained on that data. They’re going to have all the same problems. Asking these things to give you any information is like asking the average internet user what the answer is. And the average internet user is not very intelligent.

These are just amped up chat bots with data being sourced from random bits of the internet. Calling them artificial INTELLIGENCE misleads people into thinking these bots are smart of have some sort of understanding of what they’re doing. They don’t. They’re just fucking internet parrots, and they don’t have the architecture to be “fixed” from having these problems. Trying to patch these problems out is a fools errand and only masks their underlying failings.

Problem 2 also shows they have no double checks on access to private video feeds. Mixing up what’s being requested at any step and not reverifying anywhere after that point just reveals fucking terrible security practices.

No, this does actually sound like a solution. But it’s a solution that should be scattered all throughout the process, and checked at multiple steps along the way. The fact that this wasn’t here to begin with is a bigger problem than the “client library failure” as it shows Wyze’s security practices are fucking garbage. And adding “one layer” is not enough. There should be several.

To give a bit better context, which I can only be guessing at by reading between the lines of their vague descriptions and my first hand experience with these types of systems…

Essentially your devices all have unique ids. And your account has an account/user ID. They’re essentially “random numbers” that are unique within each set, but there appear to be devices that have the same ID as a some user’s user ID.

When the app wants to query for video feeds it’s going to ask the server “hey, get me the feed for devices A, B, and C. And my user ID is X”. The server should receive this, check if that user has access to those devices. But that server is just the first external facing step. It then likely delegates the request through multiple internal services which go look up the feed for those device IDs and return them.

The problem that happened is somewhere in there, they had an “oopsie” and they passed along “get me device X, X, X for user ID X”. And for whatever reason, all the remaining steps were like “yup, device X for user X, here you go”. At MULTIPLE points along that chain, they should be rechecking this and saying “woah, user X only has access to devices A, B, and C, not X. Access denied.”

The fact that they checked this ZERO times, and now adding “a layer” of verification is a huge issue imo. This should never have been running in production without multiple steps in the chain validating this. Otherwise, they’re prone to both bugs and hacks.

But no, they clearly weren’t verified to view the events. Their description implies that somewhere in the chain they scrambled what was being requested and there were no further verifications after that point. Which is a massive issue.

It doesn’t even need to go that far. If some cache mixes up user ids and device ids, those user ids should go to request a video feed and the serving authority should be like “woah, YOU don’t have access to that device/user”. Even when you fucking mix these things up, there should be multiple places in the chain where this gets checked and denied. This is a systemic/architectural issue and not “one little oopsie in a library”. That oopsie simply exposed the problem.

I don’t care if I was affected or how widespread this is. This just shows Wyze can’t be trusted with anything remotely “private”. This is a massive security failing.

What do you think the US some socialist country?! Everything must be a private country because… Capitalism! No “socialized” waste disposal here!

It sucks, Halo was a big part of my highschool years and now it feels like a really shitty money grab.

This is just modern gaming. You could replace “Halo” with almost any sizeable game from that era, and you’d have the same thing - none of them remain except to be husks of their former selves, enslaved to a large money harvesting machine.

OSRS is one of the very few exceptions to the rule, and that only came about after having spent years as a money grab before realizing people actually wanted the original back.